EPC - Should Networks Provide this Information

[Qui Gon Jinn]

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This poll is for affiliates only..

There has been a lot requested this year, mostly basic requirements, but little forthcoming, suggesting most have banded together to unduly refrain from divulging.

Assuming the figures can be topped and tailed by 10%, so that extreme figures do not dilute their accuracy. And considering all the pros & cons (if there are any cons).

EPC's - Should Networks Provide this Information to affiliates / publishers so that we can make an informed choice.

I realise this poll has been around the block a few times, but sometimes we need to re-assert the message for our own minimimal requirements.

Power to the People - Vote Wisely

[Qui Gon Jinn]

Obviously we would like conjecture from merchants or networks to ask if they are for or opposed to it?

Which puts them on the spot a bit as refraining from comment can be assumed as not for it. As it is fairly obvious which way the poll will go.

[999gi]

Theres a counter argument from Nick of TradeDoubler on this thread
http://www.a4uforum.co.uk/showthread...threadid=15942

Basically he is saying that TD are not in favour of showing EPC as it would lead to merchants dropping high volume affiliates who dont generate a good enough EPC so they can manage the figures.

Not sure if this has really happened on CJ though

[John]

In my opinion...

EPC's should be provided by all networks, without a shadow of a doubt.

EPC is the simplest way for affiliates to spot anything dodgy/untoward in EPC patterns, and a good benchmark to highlight good programs.

It would not hurt the lower-performing merchants to have a "kick up the backside" so to speak - If their EPC is low anyway, then what difference does it make hiding it from the affiliates, apart from the merchant getting free branding, the network collecting their management fees and the affiliates becoming disillutioned with a poorly-performing program??

If you top and tail the top/bottom 10%, and do not disclose new merchant's EPC for the first 3 months or so, then the figures are a very good guide - That's all they ever will be, a guide. But I'd rather have a guide than waste money on PPC for a merchant that the network already knows is a donkey but feels it's against their interests to let me know before I spend my money.

In short, the EPC system put in place by CJ has resulted in me using more CJ merchants that I would not otherwise have considered, purely on the basis of their EPC history. I have never decided not to promote anyone based on their EPC (unless of course their EPC is $0.00, but those merchants shouldn't even be on the network)

I'm earning more as a result of the EPC system, and naturally so are CJ. If the other UK networks don't think we need to know this, then it's up to us as affiliates to collate this information ourselves, and continue to lobby the networks for what is a very basic, yet immensely useful tool that they are currently denying us.

[Qui Gon Jinn]

How could we get this into action whereby we start grouping together epc's and publicising them?

It really is time to start moving on this.

Now understandably some affiliates like to keep some litlte gems to themselves, but hardly anybody would keep the poor performers to themselves.

Brand does not equate to a good program. Some of the best programs out there are little heard of.

[John]

Well, I'm not a techie so I don't know how we'd go about collating all the info.

What I can say is - As long as it's anonymous, I'd be happy to provide our EPC figures for every merchant we promote.

[Luke]

I am all for it - but I did get an email from CJ saying "Argos are worried about your conversion rate as it is affecting their EPC".

Yes those were there very words.

I sent an email back reminding them that Comet were getting exactly the same traffic and managing to convert very well... but it was really annoying to get the email in the first place.

However, topping and tailing as suggested should remove this problem as far as I can see.

[John]

yup, topping and tailing would indeed solve that problem...

Anyone with an extremely low conversion rate (those popping the URL etc) or extremely high (1 click, 1 sale wonders.. i.e those simply buying through their own links) would be discounted, leaving you with a true reflection (albeit still varied depending on the relevancy of the publisher's site/traffic) of the expected return per 100 visitors.

It's also worth noting that 1 person's conversion rate should not be able to effect a merchant's EPC dramatically.

It is worrying that you received such an e-mail, but IMO that shows a lack of understanding of the EPC system on the merchant's behalf (or an excuse to get you to give them higher coverage?)

[Mogga]

Do revtrends use all that lovely data they get?
Or do they t&c say they don't?

[Marc Gear]

what a great thread... really unanimous

i might start a poll on 'Should Merchants Validate Sales'?
or 'Do Bears **** in the Woods?'

:P

[billaffiliate]

is the pope a catholic?

[Keith]

Basically he is saying that TD are not in favour of showing EPC as it would lead to merchants dropping high volume affiliates who dont generate a good enough EPC so they can manage the figures.

There shoudn't be ay question of this happening no two affiliates are alike 'What may be right for you may not be right for some" ((sorry just had a different strokes moment) While EPC may influence me into giving a program preferential treatment I will always decide wheather to continue with a merchant after reviewing my own EPC for that merchant (top marks to CJ for providing this) over a period of time it may take off straight away or it could take months or even years to setup the right way of promoting the product/merchant, after all we are all busy people with fingers in many pies.

[NaturalInstinct]

Originally posted by 999gi
as it would lead to merchants dropping high volume affiliates who dont generate a good enough EPC so they can manage the figures.

only the stupid ones surely ?

[pistol101]

I'm going to put some EPC figures together next week and see what they look like as i've not had the time, i'm not sure they are going to be worth using, esp when you start topping and tailing them.

There are affiliates who have different arrangements with merchants and may only create one click and 1000 transactions in a week. It would be physically impossible to tag every affiliate and we wouldn't always know this was happening.

We have one merchant doing almost £200k in sales a month from less than 30 affiliates. Take out the top 10% and bottom 10% and it doesn't give much of an idea of the merchant. You need some sort of top affiliates, middle affiliates and bottom affiliates. Not to mention Pay Per click affiliates, freebie sites etc.

I've been testing a different indicator which looks much better, not going to go into it until we've looked further into it.

There are two issues with why everyone wants the EPC, one that the tracking is working and two to see which merchants are performing well. I've got the first one sorted, hopefully the second one will follow soon.

[Malcolm Cowley]

Hi Guys ,

Just got back from the wild dream that is Vegas and saw this thread.

EPC's are being done by us and if I hadnt had to pop off and gamble like a wild man over the last week then they would be here already - give us a few days after the hols and they will be there for all too see.

What we were thinking was 3 figures.

1. Top and tailed Epc

2. Top 5 or so for a programs Epc

3. Average basket size

That way you can see what the mean is and what you can achieve with really good targetted traffic so you have something to aim for.

We have no probs publishing these results as we dont charge a monthly management fee we have less worry about a bad program getting worse from affiliates being in the know that it is bad.

I think it may even push a few more UK companies into smartening up their offerings to both consumer and affiliate online.

Hope this helps :-)