Are you a Kitbag affiliate - if so read this

[Kandevil]

Just wanted to alert people to an advert that Kitbag are running on their site at present, it is directing to a competition run by another affiliate, so if your user clicks through on your link, but then goes off via this banner and clicks via one of the links on that page (including a 15% off offer which might just attract the eye!) then they will hijack your commission.

I have brought this to Kitbag's attention before posting here to give them a chance to respond, John F, Kitbag's affiliate manager said:

The "banner links to the voting section, so is not directly leaking .... but I do understand your concern. As we are sponsoring this event, we agreed to send some traffic to them for a short while to plug the awards for best boots, best brand etc. Will be removed toward the end of the week."

I have the kitbag white label on one of my sites so it overrides the banner, but not on another, so I am giving free traffic to another affiliate, as I expect many of you may be. You can contact Kitbag's affiliate manager here if you are concerned.

My solution would be to only show the adverts via non-affiliate links, just like you would do when hiding a phone number via affiliate links...

Anyone else seeing this banner through their links and think this is just wrong? Leakage is bad on its own, leakage to another affiliate???



I have also blogged about this, if you think this sort of thing isn't on please back my blog post too. See: http://www.kandevil.com

[Keith]

I think you have a valid point, you generate the traffic why should someone else benefit, they could hide the banner for affiliate cookie referrals same as phone numbers are suppressed in some cases, cant be that difficult.

[Aspire]

I'm with you on this Kandevil - although I don't send a huge amount of traffic their way at the moment it is still enough and if just one buyer ends up purchasing then I'm losing out.

I don't get the "banner links to the voting section, so is not directly leaking ... " it is in my mind considering the page it links to shouts about a 15% discount available very prominently.

If they can't do as suggested with a cookie referral, then maybe they should just take off all mention of the "awards".

[hirschnathan]

kandeveil

I disagree with your opinion. (I am not an active kitbag affiliate)

Firstly the banner for the promo is at the top of the kitbag website, I would imagine leakage is 5%
Then once you have visited the sponsor site, you have to click on the kitbag image which brings a pop up and then you have to click the kitbag name within the pop up.

So if even 10% of people click the banner and then 10% of them click the sponsor list and 10% click through back to kitbag, the percentage of leakage is miniscule

[renegade]

In principle affiliates are not ever going to be happy sending traffic which could leak to other affiliates so I'm with kandevil on this one.
The page took ages to come up and the voting page was broken when I tried "too many connections" so it's obviously been a popular page.

[Mitchy]

To flip this on its head, its good that a merchant is actively helping an affiliate by promoting their competition. So well done Kitbag for that.

However...

Originally Posted by renegade In principle affiliates are not ever going to be happy sending traffic which could leak to other affiliates so I'm with kandevil on this one.

I agree.

Originally Posted by renegade The page took ages to come up and the voting page was broken when I tried "too many connections" so it's obviously been a popular page.

Snap.

[johnlfitz]

Originally Posted by hirschnathan kandeveil I disagree with your opinion. (I am not an active kitbag affiliate) Firstly the banner for the promo is at the top of the kitbag website, I would imagine leakage is 5% Then once you have visited the sponsor site, you have to click on the kitbag image which brings a pop up and then you have to click the kitbag name within the pop up. So if even 10% of people click the banner and then 10% of them click the sponsor list and 10% click through back to kitbag, the percentage of leakage is miniscule

Just to echo hirschnathan's comments, the amount of leakage here would be minimal ..... and as mentioned the promo will be coming down in a day or two. Also, ironically, your site links via another affiliate network Ian ..... thus links coming from your site drop your network cookie. The fact is that the site that you are concerned about is on another network and this means that should anyone transact then you will still be paid your commission. So, if you're concerned about the fact that this other affiliate may drive sales then don't be ..... you will benefit from it !

Cheers

John F

[Kandevil]

Originally Posted by hirschnathan I disagree with your opinion. (I am not an active kitbag affiliate)

That's cool I respect that, not sure about your % figures, but if you have a successful site, where you are happy to be promoting another affiliate when the visitor hits the merchants site, then let me know and I'll be that affiliate, however small the % will be.

Originally Posted by Mitchy To flip this on its head, its good that a merchant is actively helping an affiliate by promoting their competition. So well done Kitbag for that.

You are right Mitchy it is great that Kitbag are helping promote an affiliate in this way, I think though it is a little misguided. The issue also then unfolded about what exposure other affiliates should get on the merchants site, if any at all. But that is another thread in itself.

Originally Posted by johnlfitz Just to echo hirschnathan's comments, the amount of leakage here would be minimal

John I personally believe that no leakage is acceptable. I can't believe many affiliates would think it is? I am prepared to be proved wrong though, so anyone else (aside hirschnathan & John) who thinks it is okay, please say so and perhaps explain why.

Aside from the chance of losing a sale, they are collecting email addresses from entrants I am sure, they will try to sell to these users again down the line, damaging future sales in the life of the cookie, or via bookmarked traffic too. These are users another affiliate has sent to Kitbag, that another affiliate is being given a chance to profit from.

Originally Posted by johnlfitz The fact is that the site that you are concerned about is on another network and this means that should anyone transact then you will still be paid your commission. So, if you're concerned about the fact that this other affiliate may drive sales then don't be ..... you will benefit from it !

Is that how it works?

I assumed that the AW cookie would take over from the AF cookie? Are you suggesting Kitbag pay out on each? Or only on the originating cookie?

This was a further point I was going to add, but your reply about the cookies has clouded my thinking on it somewhat, I'll post it anyway, sure things will become clear.

Kitbag are on 3 networks, now you are showing the banner on both AW & AF, I haven't checked TD. Anyway, so user clicks a AF link, goes to the site, sees the banner, goes off ends up with an AW link from their and makes a purchase. Now I am under the impression, that last referrer wins and AW in theory takes the commission from AF for a banner served to an AF visitor. Now this is where the minimal % stuff gets more interesting, as at network level we are talking about a lot of visitors and thus the small % which some of you think isn't important, becomes a more interest sum of £££££££.

I really am confused by your comments on the last referrer stuff though John, so until I understand that properly, my paragraph above is in limbo, but I wanted to put it out there.

I would like to say thanks John for actively joining in the debate on this, it is an interesting issue and one that is good to discuss in the open.

[Keith]

Originally Posted by johnlfitz Also, ironically, your site links via another affiliate network Ian ..... thus links coming from your site drop your network cookie. The fact is that the site that you are concerned about is on another network and this means that should anyone transact then you will still be paid your commission. So, if you're concerned about the fact that this other affiliate may drive sales then don't be ..... you will benefit from it ! Cheers John F

Like Ian I am also perplexed by this remark, are you saying that if a sale is recorded and cookies have been dropped for more than one affiliate network Kitbag will pay out on both (or even all three)?

[johnlfitz]

Originally Posted by Kandevil That's cool I respect that, not sure about your % figures, but if you have a successful site, where you are happy to be promoting another affiliate when the visitor hits the merchants site, then let me know and I'll be that affiliate, however small the % will be. You are right Mitchy it is great that Kitbag are helping promote an affiliate in this way, I think though it is a little misguided. The issue also then unfolded about what exposure other affiliates should get on the merchants site, if any at all. But that is another thread in itself. John I personally believe that no leakage is acceptable. I can't believe many affiliates would think it is? I am prepared to be proved wrong though, so anyone else (aside hirschnathan & John) who thinks it is okay, please say so and perhaps explain why. Aside from the chance of losing a sale, they are collecting email addresses from entrants I am sure, they will try to sell to these users again down the line, damaging future sales in the life of the cookie, or via bookmarked traffic too. These are users another affiliate has sent to Kitbag, that another affiliate is being given a chance to profit from. Is that how it works? I assumed that the AW cookie would take over from the AF cookie? Are you suggesting Kitbag pay out on each? Or only on the originating cookie? This was a further point I was going to add, but your reply about the cookies has clouded my thinking on it somewhat, I'll post it anyway, sure things will become clear. Kitbag are on 3 networks, now you are showing the banner on both AW & AF, I haven't checked TD. Anyway, so user clicks a AF link, goes to the site, sees the banner, goes off ends up with an AW link from their and makes a purchase. Now I am under the impression, that last referrer wins and AW in theory takes the commission from AF for a banner served to an AF visitor. Now this is where the minimal % stuff gets more interesting, as at network level we are talking about a lot of visitors and thus the small % which some of you think isn't important, becomes a more interest sum of £££££££. I really am confused by your comments on the last referrer stuff though John, so until I understand that properly, my paragraph above is in limbo, but I wanted to put it out there. I would like to say thanks John for actively joining in the debate on this, it is an interesting issue and one that is good to discuss in the open.

There's no last click referrer ..... you would be paid on sales if within 30 days. If anything this should improve your click conversions.

[johnlfitz]

Psst Ian ..... not a problem plugging a comp if you do one either.

We can donate a shirt or two as well .... maybe a little Premiership opening comp??!?!

[johnlfitz]

Originally Posted by Keith Like Ian I am also perplexed by this remark, are you saying that if a sale is recorded and cookies have been dropped for more than one affiliate network Kitbag will pay out on both (or even all three)?

Yep, helluva loverly affiliate program we have eh ?

[Keith]

Originally Posted by johnlfitz Yep, helluva loverly affiliate program we have eh ?

Excellent, do you also approve 100% of sales?

[johnlfitz]

It's around 92% approval at the moment. Sales are automatically approved when the order is despatched, or cancelled if the order is cancelled.

What sites do you run Keith?

Anyway, last post for today is this one for me . . . . I have a 6.5 month pregnant Mrs Fitz nattering in my ear hole ..........

[renegade]

Originally Posted by johnlfitz Yep, helluva loverly affiliate program we have eh ?

Isn't this wide open to abuse?!