Advantages to a Merchant? What's Your Pitch?

Thanks Lee that is what I meant, if some of these merchants had some of the affiliates on this board managing aspects of their online marketing strategy, I think you would see a dramatic increase in not only sales, but profit from those sales too.

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Because every click that they pay on PPC may not result in a lead sale etc. It may be that every 6th click produces the lead or sale for them meaning that it has infact cost then £1.50.[/quote]

Yes that is a bit obvious wardy!

trust me I am dumb, but not quite that stupid!

Anyone that manages merchants buy its very nature can't be dumb! You should have heard some the questions I was asking the Affiliate Future guys!!! Now they were dumerererer - The questions not AF before I get a

I've seen a company pay £10/click for the word "free" when they offer a virtual P.A. solution. For a product that retails at 50 squid.

Now that is dumb!

Point is, it ain't as simple as it appears. To get the best from adwords, you need to work at it (i.e. have experience). What this means, is that the affiliates are in effect unsalaried consultants who actually shoulder financial burdens for the merchants. The affiliate gets nothing back from that unless he... *does a good job*.

Now correct me if I'm wrong, but the extra 9p or whatever is in fact a pretty small price to pay to avoid having to recruit, train, salarise and p.a.y.e. someone specifically within your organisation to do the same job.

The £25K + 5K N.I + £12K overhead of hiring an inhouse 'adwords promoter' = one awful lot of clicks.

Plus, what if your company has many products? Do you hire lots of these puppies at effectively £40K each to handle each product? Or do you blindly hope one person who is good at optimising an adword campaign for your mobile fone range is also good at buying adwords for your handheld GPS systems...?

Easier to let those affiliates who 'do' the fone thing do the fone thing, and those who do the eggplant thang do the eggplant thang.

Am I right or am I right?
best
Jaja

Luke: I would use affiliates every time in place of Google,Overture and espotting!

QGJ: Yes by all means. Although I can't see your post anymore???

Helen: Sorry if I touched a nerve.

Jess :0)

Jess, it's been deleted, but I won't be deleting mine as I know what you said was as true as it gets

Helen no I don't think you are a shark, you’re a polar bear so no worries about getting my hands bitten by you . Sharks don’t take an active role in the affiliate arena, they simply use you when they need you and chuck you aside as soon as they have got what they want, they are the ones that next time they come to ask you to help in a campaign get told where to go in a polite manor (sometimes).

sorry trying to combine posts...

Most big Advertising companies are cowboys, sharks no wonder they hate affiliate marketing, they would be out of business within a week if they had to change to a rev share/pay on performance model.



I wanted to use this quote / something similar (without giving reference to source) for an upcoming discussion with your permission.

Cuddly Polar Bears or Tenacious Sharks? We know who falls where.

Luke's Quote:
"This is the greatest lie of all affiliate marketing networks, you only pay based on the sales to affiliates but as the post above me points out their are the extortionate costs - set up fee, high surcharge on those commissions and large monthly administration costs."

Just for what its worth im glad this got pointed out.
I can understand (to some extent) when large affiliate networks try to sting you with a 2K - 3K set up as they say "It goes towards the £££ we spend on our huge databases etc etc." (But it still a rip off)

But the £250 - £400 monthly charge they also slam on you takes the biscuit. I think this is damaging the network and good on Affiliate Future!

Finally, these charges are a nothing to large companies, but when trying to attract SME's these Rip off set up fee's and large monthly administration costs are going to put people off.

I thought I was the only one around here who thought the majority of networks were taking the mickey with their costs.

This is why I set up as an independent.

My costs have few a few hundred quid for the software and then my time to impliment it and manage it and no way does it take £350 a month to do this plus 30% of the commission I pay (which incidently has gone to the affiliates, not me).

Since I set up I know a couple of networks have been more flexible on costs for small businesses.

Advantages of affiliate marketing for small businesses is very great if they could get it without the high set up and management fees.

In fact I reckon the government should support small businesses with a grant so they can join the larger networks and promote their businesses so cost effectively.

Now I have not had a row in ages and I am sure this will provoke a few people.... well hey is almost the weekend!

The time and skill that goes into developing ammending upgrading ASP tracking software and reporting features and so on should be reflected in set up costs. I take my hat off to all those software developers and I can only look on with envy. Some times the integration is not black and white, scripts some times need to be written. Consultancy can take days on the best method of integration that is compatible with the newest version of shopping basket or sign up form.Then there is the maintenance and admin.

What affiliatefuture is doing is unique but I then it prompts me to question if the merchants are not paying anything in set up costs, how serious are they about their affiliate program, is the quality of merchant diluted? I am not saying for one minute that this is the case and I love affiliatefuture cos they have Pistol and Luke at the helm, but by charging a set up fee, a merchant has an investment to make his her program work.
Caroline, yes I agree the government is not your friend and I wish they would do more to support small businesses. But I feel there is a need for ASPS to charge a set up cost, but how much is an altogether separate issue and one that would take some thinking about. I would like to see a sliding scale. Blue chips should pay through the nose! Sillyjokes £199.00
My god I am never going to be offered a job in advertising or the arcadia group,lol.
Jess

What affiliatefuture is doing is unique but I then it prompts me to question if the merchants are not paying anything in set up costs, how serious are they about their affiliate program, is the quality of merchant diluted? I am not saying for one minute that this is the case and I love affiliatefuture cos they have Pistol and Luke at the helm, but by charging a set up fee, a merchant has an investment to make his her program work.

In defence of Affiliate Future (and I am sure they will come on and speak for themselves) just because you pay a set-up fee doesn’t for 2 seconds say "I am serious about affiliate marketing" we all know of big brand jokes that run programs on some networks. A set-up few of a few thousand pounds is nothing what so ever to them. Any time I speak to a merchant I can tell straight away if they are serious about using this medium, sure some might not have the kind of people skills it takes to get along with affiliates, as long as they have the right offer and responsive to requests, the network should be able to help and advice the other stuff they are not sure about.

Quality of merchant is down to the network, they can say "No" to a merchant coming on board, and if I thought someone would do more damage than good I would make sure they didn't join the network.

And by the way Affiliate Future is not unique in what the charge, as I understand it DGM now work mostly on a commission basis with new merchants and my new network offers this also, however only for the right type of merchant. I am not going to waste a merchant’s time or my time putting on a no hopers, you know the people that can’t sell there own products and are hopping affiliate marketing is the magic pill.

Hi,

Just my two pennies worth...

I think the problem is not with the waivering of the set up fee itself. There will be merchants who will work with affiliates regardless of them paying a set up fee or not...

However I know there are merchants out there that still see affiliate marketing as a cheap form of advertising and not what it is intended to be a pay for performance method. They will locate the cheapest asp (lowest or no set up fee, if possible lowest override and monthly management costs) and
join them. As they do not want to invest (or at least as little as possible) chances are they will also hardly invest in building up their program, creating relationships with their affiliates and work together on making their program a success...

I am convinced that the merchants that are prepared to work with the affiliates would even have joined if they would have had to pay a set up fee and / or monthly management fees. I have no doubts that you will try to find out if a merchant is willing to work for his / her program, but if a merchant is not prepared to pay a set up fee you just know in advance these
might be the ones taking it all for a cheap ride...

I think that the problem the new ASPs are having is that there are several established networks out there with loads of affiliates and merchants in place, an established infrastructure etc. etc. A new / newer ASP will have to compete with that and as long as they do not have a substantial network of affiliates and merchants they will offer the programs for free or with a big discount and build up their network this way (understandably).

With regards to blue chips... I think most of them will not have paid a penny with several of the networks out there, even though a £2,000 or £3,000 set up fee would be peanuts for them. But are they prepared to pay these amounts? No because they think they are soooooooooo special that you as an ASP should go down on your knees, kiss the ground they just walked on and give the program to them for free. After all that you can get the hassle of getting the payment out of them because according to their terms and conditions they will only pay their bills 60 days or 90 days (or maybe even
later) after receipt of the invoice. Tough luck if your terms and conditions state you want payment within 30 days... that is your problem... they are God. And looking around here at A4U I see complaints about these same blue chips on a regular basis.


Wouter