How Many More To Go Bust

[John Jupp]

Just noticed I'd posted when someone else had covered this so change of thread.

How many more major firms will now go to the wall following yet another dire report of an electrical retailer going bust?

BBC NEWS | England | West Yorkshire | Jobs go at electrical goods firm

[Mogga]

There's going to be loads.

For the last 10 years the economy has boomed. House price inflation has led to people thinking they're rich, credit card debt is enormous, personal debt at all time highs.

And guess what! business has been encouraged to run on debt. Expand, increase stores, build new shopping centres.

What do all the retail sector value add up to? Millions of billions of billions (I was going to add it all up but couldn't find a handy source for all uk sectors and then divide it up by the number of people in the Uk and show just how insane it's been but cba I'm afraid. Its too depressing)

On watchdog they had a brief mention of people being screwed over by low interest rates on their savings that they rely on. Then god knows how long on people in massive debt. 28k, 70k.

It's insane. It really is. And what does Gordon do? He gives the banks who've allowed the crazy party to take more money off us!
It's now showing Bailout 2 -and coming soon, Bailout 3.

They should have guaranteed all savings accounts (Cancelled out against any debts you have of course) and then let the banks go to he!!

It'll get better but not for a long time, and the longer he keeps p[laying at saving the banks then the worse it's going to be. He's trying to cure a debt addict by giving it more debt. *sighs* and back off the hobbyhorse.

[Asfora]

my theory is that these people who have the all time high debt on credit cards etc, whilst depressed about their financial situation, need to cheer themselves up with retail therapy, so they go online and spend to cheer themselves up. After all, what's £30 - £50 on a new gizmo / pair of shoes / watch etc compared to all those thousands already racked up. Drop in the ocean... so if these are my customers and i'm making commission from their misery, i feel bad BUT at the same time it is good that they could turn it round and have their own shop on http://stroke-the.chopsmonster.com and then they can claw back a bit of what they've been spending!

[fizzbird]

How many more major firms will now go to the wall following yet another dire report of an electrical retailer going bust?

Quite a lot yet I would guess?
I don't think Empire actually employed that many people tbh but not good news either way?

[Mike_Scott]

I hear a lot of people asking me..... How long do you think this will last?

The thing is I'm afraid it hasn't truely started yet.

Until the way bankers trade is changed then the money will keep drying up.
Put a recession on top of that and it only accelerates things downwards.

Sorry for the doom and gloom ..... but there's not a chink of light showing yet.

[Asfora]

I hear a lot of people asking me..... How long do you think this will last?

The thing is I'm afraid it hasn't truely started yet.

Until the way bankers trade is changed then the money will keep drying up.
Put a recession on top of that and it only accelerates things downwards.

Sorry for the doom and gloom ..... but there's not a chink of light showing yet.

No, I completely disagree! All the money in the world is only virtual anyway - just numbers on paper and who owes how much to whom! So the idea is Grab Your Share! it's only money! If someone somewhere has no money it means someone somewhere else HAS the money... it's all a game.

[fizzbird]

If someone somewhere has no money it means someone somewhere else HAS the money... it's all a game.

I don't think you understand the game to be honest. The other money isn't anywhere because it was being borrowed from the future - which doesn't exist.

The game only works in a constantly expanding economy, not a shrinking one.

[jamespoole]

Bad news for many

They were a client for a SEO friend of mine and went bust owing quite a few quid

[Asfora]

I don't think you understand the game to be honest. The other money isn't anywhere because it was being borrowed from the future - which doesn't exist.

The game only works in a constantly expanding economy, not a shrinking one.

have a look at this - it is an interesting view about the origin of money and why it comes out of thin air...: The Earth Plus 5%

and also look:

* Money did not have a single origin but developed independently in many different parts of the world.
* Many factors contributed to its development and if evidence of what anthropologists have learned about primitive money is anything to go by economic factors were not the most important.
* Money performs a variety of functions and the functions performed by the earliest types were probably fairly restricted initially and would NOT necessarily have been the same in all societies.
* Money is fungible: there is a tendency for older forms to take on new roles and for new forms to be developed which take on old roles, e.g. (this is my example) on English banknotes such as the 5 pound notes it says "I promise to pay the bearer on demand the sum of five pounds" and below that it carries the signature of the chief cashier of the Bank of England. This is a reminder that originally banknotes were regarded in Britain, and in many other countries, as a substitute for money and only later did they come to be accepted as the real thing.
from this source: Origins of Money and of Banking

and also this site is interesting too, on the same topic: http://www.moneyreformparty.org.uk/m...igins_of_money

[fizzbird]

have a look at this - it is an interesting view about the origin of money and why it comes out of thin air...:

So can I use this theory to pay my gas bill with?

[Asfora]

BUT!!! remember, Money can also disappear from thin air too: look in this example:
3 Men all have £10 each and need a T.V. They all go to the T.V. shop with their £10's. They ask "how much for that T.V.". "£30 replies the boy behind the counter", they all pay their £10 and are on their way with the T.V.
The young boy tells his boss he's sold the T.V. for 30 quid, the bos points out that the T.V. is only £25 and to catch up with the blokes and give them their fiver back.
The boy grabs 5 x £1 coins from the till and chases after the 3 men. While on his way he realises £5 doesn't split between 3 so he pockets £2.
When he catches the men he explains that they've paid too much and gives them 1 pound back each, keeping the £2 for himself.
Now each man has paid only £9 each (£27), there is £2 in the lads pocket, which is £29 altogether.
Where is the other pound??? £1 has just disappeared into thin air!!

[Asfora]

So can I use this theory to pay my gas bill with?

depends - are you with British Gas? I think if you delay payment long enough they come and install a repayment meter and every time you put £10 of credit on, it takes £7 to pay back the debt and gives you £3 of gas credit...

Money disappearing into thin air, just as it came from thin air to start with, hence proving the theory!



but i wouldn't recommend doing that cos BG always forget to send the swipe card so you don't get any gas at all... I'd recommend switching suppliers in that case - transfer the debt... play the game!! :tup

[aotagain]

I don't think you understand the game to be honest. The other money isn't anywhere because it was being borrowed from the future - which doesn't exist.

At last someone has answered what we were debating in the pub last week and the week before and the week before that...

Where has all this missing money gone ? because everyone seems to have lost it.
So it can't have really existed in the first place.
Which doesn't matter until someone says "can I have mine back now please ?"
Then the whole thing comes tumbling down until someone puts the missing link back into the circle.

[KieronD]

BUT!!! remember, Money can also disappear from thin air too: look in this example:
3 Men all have £10 each and need a T.V. They all go to the T.V. shop with their £10's. They ask "how much for that T.V.". "£30 replies the boy behind the counter", they all pay their £10 and are on their way with the T.V.
The young boy tells his boss he's sold the T.V. for 30 quid, the bos points out that the T.V. is only £25 and to catch up with the blokes and give them their fiver back.
The boy grabs 5 x £1 coins from the till and chases after the 3 men. While on his way he realises £5 doesn't split between 3 so he pockets £2.
When he catches the men he explains that they've paid too much and gives them 1 pound back each, keeping the £2 for himself.
Now each man has paid only £9 each (£27), there is £2 in the lads pocket, which is £29 altogether.
Where is the other pound??? £1 has just disappeared into thin air!!

The trick is that you're counting some of the money twice, and some of it is not being counted at all. The £9 that each man paid (totalling £27) ALREADY INCLUDES the £2 that the young boy kept, along with the £25 in the till (£25 + £2 = £27).

If you want to get back to the £30 total, you need to take in to account the £3 that the men got back. So in this riddle, the £2 that the helper kept is being counted twice, and the £3 the men got back is not being counted at all.

[Asfora]

So it can't have really existed in the first place.

nothing exists really, according to this article! They reckon the world is a giant hologram:
Our world may be a giant hologram - space - 15 January 2009 - New Scientist

LOL