Comet Open Program to Vouchercode Directories

[KevinEdwards]

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Well I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree then as I've seen codes work, I've seen them abused. There's a massive gray area with voucher codes, I tend not to see many of the issues in affiliate marketing in quite such black and white terms.

To state the use of voucher codes is not sophisticated is true. For some merchants.

Lets appreciate how the Internet has shifted power to the consumer. Brands are struggling to understand how best to capture an audience that lacks significantly less brand loyalty than just ten years ago.

Cashback and codes have driven this even further. The best site to see this in action I think is Martin Lewis' Money Saving Expert: Consumer Revenge - Credit Cards, Shopping, Bank Charges, Cheap Flights and more.

Merchants need to choose whether they want to work with them or not. I've worked with merchants who do both and I'll advise them accordingly. If however they do work with them they should do so in an informed way.

I don't claim to have all the right answers but I do have the benefit of six years at two networks to have seen a gamut of affiliate programmes perform in a variety of ways.

[Lawcom]

I totally appreciate that and realise working within the network environment you will have a certain perspective..

But for someone looking from outside that microcosm and perhaps a different angle or wider picture, is it possible that in the end when VC bubble bursts and the VC sites have damaged your affiliates who promote brand and product you will infact be left in a much weaker position..

Is it possible if and when merchants discover that VC sites do nothing to promote the business growth strategy they so carefully laid out, that you are left with merchants who have felt misled by the fact you have actively promoted their use..

Given that what I'm saying is proven to be true, that is what you will be left with, and considering your own medium term strategy would that be a position you would be happy to find yourself in ? your 2 key business components feeling disgruntled, used and no further forward..

[tijan]

You have to be fair and look at the situation in both ways. You mentioned that

What about voucher code sites shut up and die ..

They are a complete waste of time and money to merchants, who only focus on traffic statistics and make no long or medium term business sense ..

They simply steal customers looking for a final discount and in the end will damage the businesses that are pandering to them ..

Voucher code site are not stealing customers looking for final discount in any way instead they serve as steroid encouraging the Customer to goahead and make the purchase. Do you know if the customer refuses to buy from Merchant (A) because he does not provide discount, the customer would definately buy from merchant (B) with an alternative discount. The voucher code site in this case encourages to customer to buy from merchant (A) by telling him "Here is the Voucher code you looking for.. go ahead buddy to complete your order.

So whats your argument, doesnt that affiliate deserve to be rewarded for making it happen? (Think both ways mate) Comet did their research and saw the value in it. Why dont you take time out to research the market too.

The businesses that pander to them will in the end be damaged as no one will actively be promoting their products or business and you as a network will in the end crash when that bubble bursts..

No bubble is gonna burst, whats happening in these market at present is synonymous with opportunity cost. The demand for voucher code and discount is increasing on daily basis and so is the commercial value which in turn effect in many affiliates going with the flow, the situation will ease itself naturally, there is nothing anyone can do about it, merchants trying to stop it are only cracking a mid summer joke. Trying to curb the norm is like holding yourself down.

merchant and agencies who study the market trend and sees the commercial value are continously stuffing affiliates email with new voucher codes.

Managing a proper voucher code site or directory requires a lot more resources, man power and time than managing an ordinary content site and as a result of that, you'll see more voucher codes site shutting down with time due to improper management. how much do you hear about cashback sites these days? So there is no bubble bursting.

Not to mention, stealing customers from affiliates who do put the specific work in to promote the brand or product, just to have their cookie jumped on and their hard work made pointless by a dirty bone...

Customers have the right to choose what they wanna do, if voucher codes soldiers have not promoted their site in the first place customers wouldnt have seen the values in it. customers aint fools either, you can fool me once but you cant fool me twice. The fact that customers keep returning to a site on daily basis qualifies that the site is of value to them. (Customers aint goats). Why dont you add some values to your site if you dont want your customers to go to a voucher code site. Success is not an easy ride, you must be ready to face the challenge to be successful in your endeavour in which case you must be competitive.

Dont loose your customers to voucher codes site. the way sites are designed in 2000 is diff from 2009. provide complementary and alternative products to your customers so that you dont lose them to voucher code sites.
You've heard about the other side of voucher codes sites, so stand up to the challenge. Your customers dont just want bread, gone are those days, but they want bread and butter, they dont just want tooth brush they also want tooth paste. They dont just want information about the
product you are promoting they also want to know if there is a voucher code for it and if there is none, use your last idea and advice that what you are promoting does not currently have a voucher code. its just as Simple as A, B, C

In affiliate marketing, affiliate simpy earn commission as per pre defined action. What makes a voucher code affiliate an affiliate if he cannot earn commission for supplying a responsible code to the customer and encouraging them to complete an order with a voucher code with his click to reveal technology. What does it profits an affiliate when he does not use a click to reveal and the customer and merchant benefitted from the 5 sec information he provided without earning a dime from it.

IMO i think merchant trying to stop Click to Reveal are jokers and should be checked by the AMC, cause its an attempt at steal affiliate commission.

Tijan Penpee
z-mirage - Building your business is our business

[mattb811]

Respect is not the issue and if you both could let your egos go you would see that..

Networks have a position to protect as voucher codes bring them good money from one site

It is a time will tell thing but I certainly wont have a couple of know better know it alls try and put down an opinion simply because it doesn't fit with what they want to acheive..

If I worked for a network then your point may have some validity. As I don't, I struggle to see where you're coming from.

Once again I invite you to bring your opinions to the table and join in if you feel strongly about something as myself and many others do for the good of the many. It seems at the moment that you would rather snipe anonymously from the sidelines of a forum.

[hpops]

IMO i think merchant trying to stop Click to Reveal are jokers and should be checked by the AMC, cause its an attempt at steal affiliate commission.

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I'm sorry but I don't accept that in any way shape or form. Click to reveal is, at best controversial. The idea that the removal of affilates using any method which the merchant decides is negative to their business is "stealing" commission is dangerous (if you want the industry to grow that is!)
If you're sales are linked to voucher codes, great, you'll get commission. If they are linked to brand + voucher terms and there are not any valid codes - you won't.
What is wrong with that - the idea that you might not get paid for sales that you aren't actually contributing towards?

[aairbob]

Could someone just clarify a detail please ?

If Comet are only going to pay a VC site if the customer uses a VC, what happens with this route:

Content site visitor then visits VC site but doesn't use code because there isn't one.
Is the assumption being made that the VC site will not drop a cookie if there is no code.
ie. comply with IAB.

Or are we still in a position where the VC site could overwrite the content cookie.

So no affiliate gets commission.

[hpops]

Could someone just clarify a detail please ?

If Comet are only going to pay a VC site if the customer uses a VC, what happens with this route:

Content site visitor then visits VC site but doesn't use code because there isn't one.
Is the assumption being made that the VC site will not drop a cookie if there is no code.
ie. comply with IAB.

Or are we still in a position where the VC site could overwrite the content cookie.

So no affiliate gets commission.

A good question.

[ash]

Could someone just clarify a detail please ?


Or are we still in a position where the VC site could overwrite the content cookie.

So no affiliate gets commission.

I believe thats the case. If no codes are present then a click to reveal VC site can still offer a link to a user (they just can't force the click), they get the cookie but no commission from comet.

[Ross T]

Could someone just clarify a detail please ?

If Comet are only going to pay a VC site if the customer uses a VC, what happens with this route:

Content site visitor then visits VC site but doesn't use code because there isn't one.
Is the assumption being made that the VC site will not drop a cookie if there is no code.
ie. comply with IAB.

Or are we still in a position where the VC site could overwrite the content cookie.

So no affiliate gets commission.

Hi Aairbob

Last referrer cookie rules - which would not be any different from the past when user came from a content site via a VC site (not using a code) and the commission was declined for any other reason.

Please feel free to contact if you have any other questions
Regards
Ross
ross.truesdale@affiliatewindow.com
MSN: the_roos@hotmail.com

[confuscius]

I believe thats the case. If no codes are present then a click to reveal VC site can still offer a link to a user (they just can't force the click), they get the cookie but no commission from comet.

That is exactly why this is a very shrewd move by comet. A GENUINE CONTENT affiliate sends visitor to Comet, visitor looks for a discount code, finds an 'expired' one because that is where Google sent them, visitor follows the VC click bait, cookie set for VC site, customer buys and no affiliate gets paid.

So instead of content sites having their commission intercepted by VC sites then Comet is quite happy to cream this off by not paying out EVEN though there had been a completely GENUINE CONTENT affiliate in the chain.

Well done Comet because they know that VC sites will still continue to promote them on the basis that something is better than nothing. But Comet are really saying is that they perceive that if the last click in the chain added no value then no commissions are payable. Whether this is 'fair' is a whole new topic but nice to see a Merchant being as 'sharp' as some of the VC sites. Just doing business after all and it is their business and they can do what they want.

[aairbob]

OK.
So, overall, content site in same position as before, Comet better off, VC a bit worse off.

Does that basically summarise it ?

[KevinEdwards]

Surely if you accept the argument that content sites are suffering as a result of VC sites overriding last cookie, what is the difference?

There seems to be two separate issues here.

[hpops]

Hi all I'm going to start a thread in mods choice about the issues raised below - please find it here.

Voucher Code discussion - continued

To get wider industry input it felt appropriate to move out of the Awin forum - obviously any queries directly relating to the original thread should be placed here.
See you there.....

edit - sorry, posted wrong link - sorted now

[Lawcom]

So whats your argument, doesnt that affiliate deserve to be rewarded for making it happen?

And in what way do VC sites 'make it happen ' ? even given your scenario all they are giving customers is a thumbs up and a pat on the back.. Do you really believe a customer wanting to buy goes directly to a VC site to see what codes there are and says ok I'll buy that then !!

What value do they offer to the businesses ...

Let's take comet.. customer is looking for a new TV.. the first thing people do is search for information on what would be the best product to fill their needs..

They go to the sites that give more indepth tech spec, that provide reviews, previous customer feedback, the content rich sites that google that everyone here acknowledges is what makes good web..

In doing so they promote and market direct products, they develop the brand of companies, they engage the customer in to making a decision, they work with the merchants to enhance and develop their business, they expand market reach and direct in customers and traffic to the merchants reach, they develop new business, there is a synergy of building customer base and promoting the business and products of their merchants etc .. there is a far greater added value to merchants over and above making the sale.

So the customer has made their choice, they know what they want, they are on their way to a cash desk and up pops VC .. here take this voucher it gives you 5% off just tell them Eric sent you and it's yours.. what value did the VC site bring ?

So the network has in some way taken the so called 'comet experiment' and said look at the analytics, see the drop, VC sites must work.. lol..

But what if the group of comet, dixons, currys etc all said we are not giving vouchers to the ticket tout waiting by the cash desk but only to the sales people who are actively promoting our business and our products, then I'm sure you'd see a difference..

If the sales people on the floor, actually selling the products, then can say here also is a voucher discount, come back to me again if you were happy with my service, that all makes sense, it builds the relationship with customer, affiliate, merchant..

By allowing VC sites to steal those customers, the merchants are effectively strangling the very sites that are the sales people to their business, they are cutting off the initial supply which as the content sites give up their product promotion as pointless as there customers are being diverted, will in fact damage the merchants business, there will be no one out there selling or promoting or building, just VC sites waiting to pounce.

[confuscius]

Surely if you accept the argument that content sites are suffering as a result of VC sites overriding last cookie, what is the difference?

There seems to be two separate issues here.

There is no difference in my view in relation to content sites but there is a difference for the 'voucher sites with content' AND the 'content sites with vouchers' as one side gets paid and the other does not, yet the individual pages that a visitor saw could, in fact, be virtually identical.

Bottom line is that cookies that are set from the thousands of 'expired' voucher code pages that exist are now worthless to the VC sites using those methods in the case of Comet - it will be interesting to see if other Merchants follow suit and grab back some of the commissions they shell out. Clearly other Merchants will be happy to receive the sales that VC sites can generate regardless of whether they have codes or not.

Let's face it the majority of the large VC sites rank so well because of their ability to spin millions of keyword mixing pages into Google and whether a merchant has a code or not is irrelevant to them as they are there MAINLY to set cookie.

Hats off to Comet for finding the new Merchant 'clickbait commission clawback cookie' - now let's see how other Merchants react to this.