Dixons Poor Commission Rates Discussed

[Shane]

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Ok I understand the thought process there keith and yes I can appreciate it does make some sense but in this situation essentially it's like you are saying If I have to be bitten can I pick a little dog to do it as it might not hurt as much.. you are still putting your ass our there for free to be bitten at NO risk to dixons and only a potential reward to you.

joking aside this is a situation that has the potential to develop down a road that benefits nobody except the merchant, if a mechant is pushing a product in a feed you should get paid on it ..

Is this not the same as leakage on a mechant site but now fed onto yours ? but you are saying it's kinda palatable as if they buy something other than the zero commission product they clicked trhough on you MAY earn something.. are people really that desparate for commission that they will take what's fed to them instead of choosing what to push thinking ahead and making their business sustainable ?

when I worked for whitbread's brewery many moons ago we sat blearly eyed through a course on the "3 circles of perception" basically it's this.. imagine 3 circles, outer, middle and an centre..

In the center is the cast in stone stuff, bare bones, happens day in day out stuff..

Middle circle is the stuff that's an added service or or something that happens occaisionally, isn't a suprise but only someimes happens

Outer circle is the one off.. very rare stuff, it happens now and then and depending how it's addressed, received or managed it doesn't come back or happen again or it moves inwards to the middle circle then eventually to the centre circle

what's on the periphery usually moves towards the centre unless there's a good reason it gets stopped in it's tracks.

Selective reduced commission is bad, have dixons selectively Doubled commission by equal measure on highly profitable products ? .. think not.. so that's bad.. but zero commission is unnaceptable..

if you want to end up pushing merchants on a "cookie lottery" basis then go for it but if you let this get a foot in the door then in time it will be a case of variable commission being standard then zero commission on a selected range and eventually everyone will be playing the datafeed zero commission lottery if some merchants have their way.

[drivetowin]

Shane

I do agree with what you're saying - we are at the top of a very slippery slope but I think unless AW turn around to Dixons and say "we're going to kick you off the network unless you pay commission on everything" - which I don't believe for one minute they are going to do, though AW have surprised me before so anything's possible.

The only way I can see around this would be for AW to remove the ability to set different commissions for different products, but then that would put them at a disadvantage and doubtless Dixons would up tools and move to another network.

It has to be a process of education and AW meeting with Dixons is a good first step - personally I think it would have been better if they had invited a couple of affiliates to the meeting too so the affiliates could argue their corner but as it is we will have to rely on AW to argue the case for us.

What interests me is that when I've questioned the 0.5% tiers earlier, here:

http://www.affiliates4u.com/forums/a...ncentives.html

and back here in May:

http://www.affiliates4u.com/forums/a...te-window.html

Not one of the people posting now jumped in to back me up......

So is it just, "it didn't affect us then so we couldn't be bothered........."

As is too often the case, apathy rules.............

[Qui Gon Jinn]

What is the difference between ignorance and apathy?

I don't know, and I couldn't care less.

[Miche]

Hi All,

I just wanted to confirm to you the Currys commission structure.

For sales made online the base rates are tiered as follows:

2%
3% when the value of confirmed sales is equal to or more than £25,000
3.5% when the value of confirmed sales is equal to or more than £60,000

Currys pay 0% on the delivery cost, and 0% on Wii console/packages

For Reserve & Collect, the base rates are tiered as follows:

1.5%
2.5% when the value of confirmed sales is equal to or more than £25,000
3% when the value of confirmed sales is equal to or more than £60,000

For the sales mentioned in the thread that was £300-odd in value, the commission could not be 50p as the lowest rate is 1.5% if it was a reserve and collect sale (£4.50 min). Could you please send me your affiliate ID and date this commission was on so i can investigate for you.

This is a fantastic time to promote Currys, they have FREE DELIVERY on all orders over £40 (this has been extended so no set end date as yet).

There is also a selection of Christmas themed animated .gifs, and brand new flash banners that match the excellent TV offers (updated weekly as the deals go live).

If you have any questions please dont hestitate to get in touch with me,

kindest regards

Michelle

Key Account Manager
michelle.boxall@affiliatewindow.com
0208 269 4859

[befuddle]

My Currys sales have stopped as soon as the code went. My visitors are searching my site for a Currys code as they are all hitting the currys-ishop and partmaster pages in desperation.

If you could provide a code for Free Delivery (let's call it FREEDELIVERY) and it offered exactly what you're offering now (Free Delivery) then I'm sure I'd make more sales than currently.

[gadget]

.. For clarification, we have contacted Dixons regarding this and Julia and I are meeting with them on Thursday and will discuss in more detail - no final decision has been made.

Richard

Richard - Can you let us know what was discussed / agreed pls?

[Julia Stent]

Hi

We discussed this thread in detail during our meeting with Dixons on Thursday. Please see this post which includes a detailed explanation of Dixons' intentions with regards to their commission structure.

http://www.affiliates4u.com/forums/a...tml#post358582

I think the issue surrounding the inclusion of zero commission products in datafeeds is a separate topic to how Dixons choose to structure their affiliate payments. I would like to see how affiliate opinions are added to this thread over the weekend - http://www.affiliates4u.com/forums/a...stmas-not.html

On Monday we will discuss this internally and get back to you.

Have a great weekend

Julia

[hpops]

Julia et al at AWIN

Love you guys this year, think you deserved the awards and everything. Totally understand the situation you're in. Really, really do.

However.....

This is, indeed a slippery slope, this is not leakage, although that is bad, this is not deeply poor commissions, although that is bad, this is not even zero commissions on some products, which is terrible, this is FREE PROMOTION ACROSS ALL YOUR PUBLISHERS SITES - maybe a bit overstated, but with the use of Shopwindow and other feed based systems it certainly has the potential, I'm sure that one the key benefits for shopwindow has been the ability to effectively reach the "tail" of affiliate marketing and allow easy promotion - not to mention your high profile publisher based deals - Newspaper groups etc. Which of those publishers have been DELIBERATELY NOTIFIED THAT SOME OF THEIR TRAFFIC WILL GENERATE NO REVENUE! Its your network guys, surely you care that its giving out free rides.

This is not an attack on AWIN, I just feel that, unusually for you guys, you're allowing something to happen without seriously considering the consequences. And thats unnerving, and should be. I'm sure you'll work a path through this, but I think it should be a locked in rule when it comes to products, and its a pretty simple one - no commission, no promotion!

[Rand0m]

From our point of view, we're working our proverbials off running nine sites and between them we maybe get between two and six sales a month (all AW so far). We really appreciate the support we get from the folks at AW, but it's pretty crushing when you see a sale's come in and it turns out to be 22p commission from Dixons. We thought three quid from Curries on almost £170 was bad until we saw what Dixons were paying. You really do start to wonder why you're bothering and whether you ought to just give up and get a job.

Guys - perhaps when you next meet with Dixons you might politely explain to them that we're not all starry-eyed and honoured at being given the opportunity to be associated with their brand, we're looking for a business partnership with them. Being a bricks and mortar market leader counts for nothing on here if they're going to act towards us like a dodgy bucket shop on the Tottenham Court Road.

[Qui Gon Jinn]

Interesting how Dixons appear on various price comparisons sites for which have affiliate programs and pay per click, though I haven't checked their full range of products on there.

Buy cheap dixons - Miscellaneous. Find Miscellaneous for a low price with Shopping.com UK.

Also Awin links at the bottom of that page, which got me looking again at the terms & conditions for Dixons.

I realise this is a side note, but may I ask when the closed PPC group was introduced for Dixons, as this would have been another reason for us personally to remove them, we don't have it on our records here ! And why is an Awin affiliate bidding on Dixons electrical store but sending to Vodafone? We do have a few more, but that one should suffice.

Dixons electrical store - Google Search

[adamski]

Paul,

Interesting how Dixons appear on various price comparisons sites for which have affiliate programs and pay per click, though I haven't checked their full range of products on there.

Buy cheap dixons - Miscellaneous. Find Miscellaneous for a low price with Shopping.com UK.

Also Awin links at the bottom of that page, which got me looking again at the terms & conditions for Dixons.

The links at the bottom of the Shopping.com page are tracker links and not affiliate links. DSGi use our software to track the performance of online campaigns outside the affiliate channel.

I realise this is a side note, but may I ask when the closed PPC group was introduced for Dixons, as this would have been another reason for us personally to remove them, we don't have it on our records here ! And why is an Awin affiliate bidding on Dixons electrical store but sending to Vodafone? We do have a few more, but that one should suffice.

Dixons electrical store - Google Search

Dixons have operated closed PPC since launch. This is clearly stated on their programme description page and in the terms and conditions each affiliate agreed to on joining the programme. Additionally, affiliates are informed by way of an email which is sent once they are approved to the programme. Each time the closed group is mentioned, affiliates are invited to contact us for more information on the arrangement. Simply email dixons@affiliatewindow.com if you would like to find out more.

The affiliate bidding on Dixons brand and sending traffic to Vodafone is in breach of programme T&Cs. The situation is currently being addressed. Unfortunately, situations like this occur on a daily basis in this industry and, whilst we have software that helps us identify it, we face a constant battle ensuring keyword restrictions are adhered to.

Adam

[adamski]

Julia et al at AWIN

Love you guys this year, think you deserved the awards and everything. Totally understand the situation you're in. Really, really do.

However.....

This is, indeed a slippery slope, this is not leakage, although that is bad, this is not deeply poor commissions, although that is bad, this is not even zero commissions on some products, which is terrible, this is FREE PROMOTION ACROSS ALL YOUR PUBLISHERS SITES - maybe a bit overstated, but with the use of Shopwindow and other feed based systems it certainly has the potential, I'm sure that one the key benefits for shopwindow has been the ability to effectively reach the "tail" of affiliate marketing and allow easy promotion - not to mention your high profile publisher based deals - Newspaper groups etc. Which of those publishers have been DELIBERATELY NOTIFIED THAT SOME OF THEIR TRAFFIC WILL GENERATE NO REVENUE! Its your network guys, surely you care that its giving out free rides.

This is not an attack on AWIN, I just feel that, unusually for you guys, you're allowing something to happen without seriously considering the consequences. And thats unnerving, and should be. I'm sure you'll work a path through this, but I think it should be a locked in rule when it comes to products, and its a pretty simple one - no commission, no promotion!

We appreciate your feedback and have already discussed a technical solution to the problem. Affiliates should have clear visiblity on the commission rate for products in the feed and the option to exclude products from the ShopWindow toolset should be made available. I would ask for your patience on this issue while we work out the most appropriate solution..

However, I think you hit the nail on the head when you said your point was over stated. We don't generate any revenue on products with 0% commission and it would therefore be commercial suicide to allow this to happen on a grand scale.

We carefully analyse the performance of the 0% and 0.5% commission groups and they account for just 3.13% of Dixons sales value. We will not allow this to creep up and we will actively encourage Dixons to look at better incentives on other product lines.

Adam

[Qui Gon Jinn]

Please see my reply on here on how the 3.13% is not the correct interpretation & whole story

http://www.affiliates4u.com/forums/a...structure.html

Hi Julia,

Thank you for the report, but it doesn't address why Dixons, flouted good merchant / affiliate silent code of conduct by permitting (sneaking) 0% products into the feed, thus part of the initial question remains unanswered.

3.13% is 3.13%, on the figures so they "claim", doesn't matter if only 2% of that was attributed to 0% products, that is still money which otherwise could have been in the affiliates pocket & from a personal perspective 18000 clicks was lot more that 3.13% of the total clicks.

Also pointing out it's mentioned at 3.13% of sales value, what is the % of sales volume?

Maybe a different figure altogther. As white goods at £300 plus versus smaller ticket items at less than £30 for example offsets this by a 10:1 ratio and looks like possibly massaging the figures from the full facts. ie if three products sold at higher commission of £300 and one at 0%/0.5% (£30)this is a 25% of the sales order volume yet only approx 3% of sales value. Can you see how the figures given can be very misleading from the % of sales value you quote to the % of sales volume I quote and how there is a complete contrast.

All this has done is illustrate their own reasoning of commission tiers for product groups which in instances do not compare fabourably with other merchants with a little sales pitch. In principle I like the concept of commission groups, but only if fairly applied & properly calculated for the higher grossing products, without liberties not being taken.

Thus the 0% products in the feed still remains. An answer hasn't been given!?

I will post examples of my own personal figures later on what % of those sales fell into the 0.5% bracket. I think we need to treat the o.5% and 0% commissions as two seperate inter related topics.

[km8]

Please see my reply on here on how the 3.13% is not the correct interpretation & whole story

I've read that and don't see how your interpretation contradicts Julia's.
Julia seems to be saying she wants the affiliate channel to drive customers for high-value and high-margin products. They don't want the low-value customers looking for a USB lead.

If I'm a shoe shop and you send me thousands of customers looking for shoelaces, don't expect me to pay you enough to encourage you to keep doing that. I may pay you pennies on the off-chance one of you referrals will splash out on a new pair of boots or will come back next year - but that's all I'm paying you for.

I will post examples of my own personal figures later on what % of those sales fell into the 0.5% bracket.

Please dont!
Dixon's don't want your "usb cables" traffic, regardless of what % of your sales they are or how well they convert - they're still only looking for "a usb cable".

Julia has explained that what they want affiliates to promote, and will pay (slightly more) handsomely for is traffic for "high-end Plasma TVs".

I see Julia's/Dixon's point but on the other hand, they need to include that info within the feed so we can program which products to promote.

[Qui Gon Jinn]

So does it mean merchant would prefer cake & eat it?

Just for you here is the don't

Sales 26
Total Sales Value = £7760.45
Average Sales Value = £298.48 (hardly a USB cable?!)
Total Commission = £60.61
Average Commission = £2.33
Total Clicks = 18,763
Average Commission % = 0.78%

As summarised in previous thread sales volume & sales value are quite different figures, by quoting the lower can make it seem insigficant ie sales value can make it mis-assumed insignificant.