Brand Bidding Issue

[sticky]

Joined up for a new merchant a few weeks ago and started some PPC which included brand bidding. (There was no additional program terms to agree to and nothing in the program details to say it was a no no at the time).

After 3 weeks we had the program ended because of brand bidding

We had sent them 12000 visitors in those few weeks (80% on general terms rather than brand). The merchant deleted all the transactions and have said they wont reinstate any transactions as I broke the rules. CJ's response was its not their problem and speak to the merchant yourself.

It was a honest mistake (and certainly not clear at all when joining) but do you think I should have been paid for the general terms ads sales (remove the brand bid ones) or not?

[Keith]

Originally Posted by sticky CJ's response was its not their problem and speak to the merchant yourself.

terrible, another reason not to work with CJ

[hpops]

[quote=sticky;323780]There was no additional program terms to agree to and nothing in the program details to say it was a no no at the time.

After 3 weeks we had the program ended because of brand bidding

CJ's response was its not their problem and speak to the merchant yourself.

It was a honest mistake QUOTE]

Frankly, it wasn't a mistake, you were operating within the terms. The sales should stand, the network should enforce it and there response if it was as stated, is appaling.

[sticky]

[quote=hpops;323789]

Originally Posted by sticky There was no additional program terms to agree to and nothing in the program details to say it was a no no at the time. After 3 weeks we had the program ended because of brand bidding CJ's response was its not their problem and speak to the merchant yourself. It was a honest mistake QUOTE] Frankly, it wasn't a mistake, you were operating within the terms. The sales should stand, the network should enforce it and there response if it was as stated, is appaling.

The merchant has in the last few days added no brand bidding on the program details bit but apparently the protected keywords were there in the "keyword links" section then you clicked on get html to see them. Personally never used the keyword links section and surely this is too hidden to be noticed. I tried re-joining the program and there is no additional T&C that you have to agree to like most of their programs which mentions of no brand bidding etc would be and other restrictions.

[KirstyM]

CJ is a bit of a minefield when it comes to bidding on merchant brands. Terms are not always clear, or even present at all and CJ will not intervene on your behalf if you fall foul of a merchant in this way.

I recently had my whole account put on hold after sending brand traffic to a merchant who had no mention of their rules anywhere. Said (alleged) merchant complained to CJ and didn't contact me. CJ USA then put my account on hold and didn't tell CJ UK a thing about it!

[Qui Gon Jinn]

My suggestion would be to acquire a dedicated account manager at the UK office, so that communication comes via them, rather than the US network quality team that leaves a lot to be desired, it might help channel concerns & diffuse situations.

Myself & other affiliates have been through similar experiences. The latest was when we were being vocal about ebay's url brand infringements, then ebay uk complained that we were brand bidding where ads showed on a small search engine that was only a couple of weeks old, we offered to acquire communication from that search engine to confirm we were not brand bidding... however what they failed to realise was that we actually owned that search engine which left egg on ebays face.

That aside establish communication with the UK office who are more amenable than the US .. it's a shame that the US network quality team hasn't improved .. we have a number of stories we could tell .. it's just a shame that the US approach is guilty first, then proving your innocence .. and then when you are correct, no apology. They need to work on informing affiliates properly when keywords policies change or are added. Fortunately most UK networks send out courteous emails allowing for genuine errors or give adequate notice to changes, then you get the odd one (not CJ) who cowardly slag untruths about you behind your back, even to your good mates, this individual at a certain network will be blogged, no prizes to guess who.

Back on track, it's been requested for years that keyword policy changes & program closures, need to be effectively communicated and not be inserted after the event or not communicated at all.

[sticky]

Originally Posted by Qui Gon Jinn My suggestion would be to acquire a dedicated account manager at the UK office, so that communication comes via them, rather than the US network quality team that leaves a lot to be desired, it might help channel concerns & diffuse situations.

I have to admit after e-mail communications with the US Network "Quality" team do feel they want to put me in the electric chair for my crimes!

I did phone the UK customers services number but they said as Network quality had been involved they are not allowed to intervene. Is there anyone else in the UK who might be allowed to talk?!

[guyguy]

[quote=sticky;323790]

Originally Posted by hpops Personally never used the keyword links section and surely this is too hidden to be noticed. I tried re-joining the program and there is no additional T&C that you have to agree to like most of their programs which mentions of no brand bidding etc would be and other restrictions.

I cannot agree here.If the information is there ie: in the keyword link section then i don't see you have a leg to stand on. Very few merchants allow brand bidding these days so you should have clarified the situation with CJ. A phone call or an email perhaps.

Surely we have a collective responsibility to find out where we can and cannot bid.
The networks and merchants are not perfect in supplying this info and this is common knowledge. The solution is to be proactive and get a difinitive answer.

Sean

[Qui Gon Jinn]

I must admit, though emails to & fro from CJ UK were quite brash, telephone conversations were however very civil and problems ironed out & US network quality (an inadeqate name) were taken out of the equation. It won't be the last time they will prove to be a nuisance, and their attitude has always been despicable, impersonable & accountable for numerous unfair actions.

Perhaps try telephoning the UK office again and speak with Steve or Lolly. I don't hold out much hope of commissions being returned but ask them to provide the search strings & refferer urls being used for EACH sale and EVERY click, then try and clawback those which came from non branded terms. Network Quality have to be made to work. If you have noticed any policies changing or being added to this merchant without any notification, then they are in effect breaching contract.

With CJ you do have to tip toe through the tulips & be "wary of the minefield", policies changing without notification is common place, though as a suggestion we try and envoke and push forward to anyone, to protect your backside, print off & time stamp the current policy of any program if any, if you have the resources even have a witness verying what you are doing sitting beside you. Genuine errors do occur & there does need to be tolerance.

May I ask when this occurred, because they might hold back your next payment, I don't wish to worry you, but that is what they do, where the issue maybe with just the one merchant it in effect, affects your relationship with all merchants if that happens.

May I be bold enough to enquire to the merchants name?

Good luck with it, but if you have any further questions feel welcome to post here and I will try to assist together with any other forum members who are willing.

[sticky]

Originally Posted by Qui Gon Jinn May I ask when this occurred, because they might hold back your next payment, I don't wish to worry you, but that is what they do, where the issue maybe with just the one merchant it in effect, affects your relationship with all merchants if that happens. May I be bold enough to enquire to the merchants name?

A few weeks ago and its Outdoor Megastore.

It reply to Gugguys comments - I have never used the keyword link section and as far as I concerned that is not making is obvious like a T&C bit or in the actual program details. As a matter of interest they have added something on the program details in the last few days which seems to imply I was correct in saying its not clear

[Qui Gon Jinn]

We have just had another issue with Network Quality today where they are wrong yet again for a merchant called Freemans, we don t even use CJ links for that merchant nor promote them via MSN. Looks like either CJ Network quality or the new ppc company of Freemans are using, have balls'd up again. And yet again the manners of network quality & refusal to take calls or provide contact names is denied. Glad I am not the one calling in, as I play the good cop, I have sent bad cop in instead.